Value Investing with Legends

In this episode, Michael Mauboussin welcomes Eddie Perkin, former Chief Investment Officer at Eaton Vance and Goldman Sachs Asset Management, to discuss the principles behind better investment decision-making. Eddie shares how his early experiences shaped his investment philosophy before examining quality value investing, behavioral biases, and the importance of process over outcomes. The conversation explores leadership, collaborative conflict, confirmation bias, portfolio construction, selling discipline, and how investment organizations can create environments that encourage independent thinking. Eddie also reflects on the future of investing, the opportunities created by technological change, and the books and ideas that continue to influence his thinking—and much more!


Key Topics
Eddie Perkin's background and journey into investing (2:58) 

Early lessons in behavioral biases and groupthink (6:31) 

The "Mercedes with a scratch" approach to quality value investing (9:03) 

Investing across U.S., European, and emerging markets (10:54) 

Why great businesses should be identified before valuation screens (13:15) 

Developing variant perception through research and preparation (15:12) 

Leading investment teams through focus, accountability, and empowerment (17:58) 

The behavioral biases that damage investment organizations most (21:01) 

The Robinson Crusoe exercise for identifying long-term compounders (22:43) 

Outcome bias and lessons from NFL two-point conversion decisions (25:11) 

Combating confirmation bias with devil's advocates and AI (29:32) 

Improving investment sell decisions through process and discipline (32:20) 

Active management, indexing, and market efficiency (35:17) 

Time horizons, retail investors, and short-term market noise (37:31) 

Leading teams through organizational change during the financial crisis (39:22) 

Hiring for curiosity, independent thinking, and constructive conflict (41:37) 

Running effective investment meetings and encouraging dissent (44:10) 

Specialists versus generalists in investment research (46:56) 

Incentives that reinforce performance and collaboration (48:18) 

Advice for aspiring investment professionals and the role of AI (50:18) 

Why Eddie remains optimistic about the future of investing (53:06) 

Eddie's book and podcast recommendations (54:38) 

And much more! 


Mentioned in this Episode
Eaton Vance 

Goldman Sachs Asset Management 

Morgan Stanley Investment Management 

Invesco 

Babson College 

Columbia Business School 

Berkshire Hathaway 

Bank of America 

Nike 

FactSet 

SpaceX 

Running Against the Herd: Battling Biases to Make Better Investment Decisions — Eddie Perkin 

The Courage to Be Disliked — Ichiro Kishimi & Fumitake Koga 

Quest for Value — G. Bennett Stewart III 

Robinson Crusoe — Daniel Defoe 

What Happens Next podcast — Larry Bernstein 




Thanks for Listening!
 
Be sure to subscribe on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And feel free to drop us a line at valueinvesting@gsb.columbia.edu.
 
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In this episode, hosts Tano Santos and Michael Mauboussin welcome Django Davidson, Partner and Portfolio Manager at Hosking Partners, for a discussion of the capital cycle approach to investing. Django shares how his unconventional upbringing, experience covering banks during the Global Financial Crisis, and early exposure to Warren Buffett's letters shaped his investment philosophy. The conversation explores the origins of the capital cycle framework, how investors can identify industries experiencing excessive capital formation or capital scarcity, and why patience and long-term capital are essential to capturing opportunities. They also examine current AI investment trends, the evolution of the semiconductor industry, Japan's corporate reforms, and several real-world investment case studies, including Micron Technology and Saga. The discussion concludes with reflections on industrial resilience, supply chains, and book recommendations—and much more!

Key Topics:
● Django's upbringing, education, and path into investing (2:08)
● Lessons from covering banks during the Global Financial Crisis (3:50)
● Discovering Warren Buffett's letters and their influence on his investment philosophy (5:33)
● Investing during periods of crisis and the importance of trust in financial systems (7:23)
● The origins and foundations of the capital cycle framework (12:58)
● Using the capital cycle as a lens for contrarian investing (16:28)
● Long-term capital and identifying multi-bagger opportunities (19:59)
● Japan's corporate reforms and improving returns on capital (23:30)
● Timing challenges, diversification, and capital cycle investing (28:07)
● AI, semiconductor investment, and today's technology spending boom (32:15)
● Google, AI economics, and capital deployment considerations (40:30)
● Micron Technology and the evolution of the memory semiconductor industry (42:08)
● The Saga investment case study and opportunities in overlooked businesses (44:35)
● Demographics, aging consumers, and serving older customers effectively (49:59)
● Supply chain resilience and industrial capacity in Western economies (51:53)
● Django's book recommendations (54:05)
● And much more!
 

Mentioned in this Episode:
● Hosking Partners
● Deutsche Bank
● TCI Fund Management
● Micron Technology
● Google
● Meta Platforms
● Oracle Corporation
● OpenAI
● Anthropic
● Walmart
● First Quantum Minerals
● Saga plc
● The Material World
● The Bolter
 
Thanks for Listening!
 
Be sure to subscribe on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And feel free to drop us a line at valueinvesting@gsb.columbia.edu.
 
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Jim Flynn is the Managing Partner of Deerfield Management, a healthcare-focused investment firm overseeing approximately $16 billion in assets. In this episode, hosts Michael Mauboussin and Tano Santos speak with Jim about his path from studying biology and economics to leading one of the industry's most distinctive healthcare investment platforms. Jim explains how Deerfield evolved from a public-equity-focused firm into an organization spanning public markets, private investments, venture creation, drug development, data science, and philanthropy. The conversation examines the challenges of healthcare investing, the importance of probabilistic thinking, the role of artificial intelligence in healthcare delivery and drug discovery, and Deerfield's approach to identifying opportunities across the healthcare ecosystem. Jim also shares insights on senior housing, healthcare innovation, regulatory dynamics, and the skills required for the next generation of healthcare investors, and much more! 
 
Key Topics:


● Jim Flynn's background in biology, economics, and early investing influences (2:27)
● Lessons from working in corporate development and understanding business operations (4:30)
● Joining Deerfield and the evolution from analyst to firm leader (7:52)
● Expanding Deerfield beyond public equities into venture, private investments, and philanthropy (10:36)
● Building a flexible healthcare investment platform across market cycles (13:58)
● The Melinta case study and transforming a distressed investment into an operating success (14:32)
● Artificial intelligence and its potential impact on healthcare delivery and diagnosis (18:52)
● AI adoption challenges and the role of healthcare institutions in driving change (22:13)
● Why proprietary healthcare data creates durable investment advantages (25:50)
● The creation of Deerfield Discovery and Development and CURE (27:12)
● Cross-pollination between public and private investing at Deerfield (31:05)
● The NewAmsterdam Pharma (NewValent) case study from concept to multibillion-dollar company (33:08)
● Investing in senior housing and demographic-driven opportunities (36:20)
● Evaluating healthcare policy, drug pricing, and regulatory risks through a long-term lens (40:16)
● Skills and characteristics needed for future healthcare investors (43:09)
● What worries and motivates Jim Flynn as a healthcare investor (44:30)
● Deerfield's investment process, team structure, and reducing analytical bias (46:53)
● Personal healthcare practices, longevity, and access to medical information (51:25)
● And much more!
 
Mentioned in this Episode:
● Deerfield Management
● Alpharma
● Kidder Peabody
● GlaxoSmithKline
● Sanofi
● Hospital for Special Surgery
● Brookdale Senior Living
● OpenAI
● ChatGPT
● GRAIL
● Food and Drug Administration 
 
Thanks for Listening!
 
Be sure to subscribe on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And feel free to drop us a line at valueinvesting@gsb.columbia.edu.

Follow the Heilbrunn Center on social media on Instagram, LinkedIn, and more!

In this episode, hosts Tano Santos and Michael Mauboussin speak with Matthew Fine, portfolio manager at Third Avenue Management, about his path into investing and the firm's value-driven philosophy. Matthew reflects on lessons from early experiences like the Argentine crisis and explains how balance sheet strength and long-term thinking shape investment decisions. The conversation examines global opportunities across Europe, Japan, and commodities, along with the role of resource conversion in value creation. They also discuss market structure shifts, portfolio resilience during crises, and the challenges of identifying mispriced assets in a changing investment landscape and much more!
 
Key Topics:
● Introduction and background of Matthew Fine (0:00)
● Early interest in investing and joining Third Avenue (3:37)
● First investments during the dot-com bubble (5:54)
● Marty Whitman's influence and value investing philosophy (7:23)
● Importance of downside thinking and credit mindset (9:20)
● Benchmark agnosticism and high active share (10:14)
● Experience during the Argentine crisis (11:45)
● Generalists vs. specialists in investing (14:12)
● Financial strength and resource conversion explained (18:34)
● Portfolio resilience during major market crises (21:28)
● Understanding market disagreement and investor behavior (24:54)
● Impact of passive investing and short-term strategies (30:27)
● Artificial intelligence and investment process (33:03)
● European banks and Bank of Ireland case study (34:38)
● CK Hutchison and value creation through transactions (40:42)
● Commodity investing and copper thesis (45:14)
● Opportunities and challenges in Japan (49:26)
● Advice for students entering investment management (53:22)
● Concerns about U.S. equity valuations and future outlook (55:28)
● Book recommendations and closing thoughts (56:59)
● And much more!

Mentioned in this Episode:
● Third Avenue Management
● Bank of Ireland
● Deutsche Bank
● CK Hutchison
● BlackRock
● MSC (Mediterranean Shipping Company)
● The Sugar King of Havana
● How the World Really Works – Vaclav Smil
● Pioneering Portfolio Management – David Swensen
● Ten Global Trends Every Smart Person Should Know About – Marian Tupy


Thanks for Listening!
 
Be sure to subscribe on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And feel free to drop us a line at valueinvesting@gsb.columbia.edu.

Follow the Heilbrunn Center on social media on Instagram, LinkedIn, and more!

In this episode, hosts Michael Mauboussin and Tano Santos speak with Jenny Harrington, CEO of Gilman Hill Asset Management, about her approach to dividend-focused investing. Jenny shares her journey from early internships to portfolio management and explains how her strategy targets steady income through high-quality dividend-paying companies. The discussion examines risk management through cash flow, valuation discipline, and behavioral considerations that influence investor outcomes. Jenny also outlines her screening process, portfolio construction, and how she evaluates dividend sustainability. The conversation touches on lessons from market cycles, the role of communication in investing, and how technological changes may shape future opportunities and risks and much more!



Key Topics:


● Introduction to dividend investing and its role in total returns (0:00)
● Jenny Harrington's early career and path into portfolio management (3:05)
● Lessons from internships and exposure to market professionals (3:10)
● Experience at Goldman Sachs and insights from the dot-com bubble (10:03)
● Transition to Neuberger Berman and developing an income strategy (15:01)
● Philosophy of portfolio management and client-focused outcomes (16:45)
● Structure of the dividend income strategy and screening process (20:58)
● Differences between dividend income and dividend growth investing (27:30)
● Portfolio construction, position sizing, and diversification approach (36:25)
● Case study: Clorox investment thesis and valuation framework (40:03)
● Case study: Best Buy and identifying value through free cash flow (46:06)
● Impact of Columbia Business School on investment philosophy (49:48)
● Importance of communication and behavioral discipline in investing (54:47)
● Views on AI, job disruption, and future market implications (57:02)
● Book recommendations and information sources (59:06)
● And much more!
 
Mentioned in this Episode:
 ● Gilman Hill Asset Management
● Goldman Sachs
● Neuberger Berman
● Columbia Business School
● CNBC
● Van Leeuwen Ice Cream
● Best Buy
● Clorox
● Kimberly-Clark
● IBM
● Hewlett Packard
● PayPal
● Poor Charlie's Almanack by Charles T. Munger
● Pioneering Portfolio Management by David Swensen
● Elon Musk by Walter Isaacson
 
Thanks for Listening!
 
Be sure to subscribe on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. And feel free to drop us a line at valueinvesting@gsb.columbia.edu.
 
Follow the Heilbrunn Center on social media on Instagram, LinkedIn, and more!